Runboard.com
You're welcome.
Community logo


runboard.com       Register for a free global account (learn about it) | Log in: (), globally (lost password?)


 
Black Drazon Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

Lord
Global user

Registered: 04-2005
Posts: 217
Reply | Quote
Race-Themed Dungeons?


I've been trying to summerize the old threads like I said I would, but it would have been a lot easier if I'd have gone through the threads in order :S. I've been so confused as to what was decided where that I'm taking a breather.


As I was going through the threads in my confusion, I remembered that a while ago we considered a way of creating "race-themed" dungeons. These were suggested to stem the odd process of stopping an evil Vampire's plans by slaughtering his throngs of malign, evil... Choas Warriors? Goblins? Dark Elves? How many times have you been out hunting Orc Warlords and found nothing but Chaos Dwarfs before you entered the Objective Room?

The trouble with Race-Themed dungeons is that the obvious solution to the problem is to create a minimum of 60 monster tables (10 levels for each of Chaos, Dark Elves, Orcs and Goblins, Skaven, Tomb Kings, Vampire Counts) though even this doesn't get properly into the Warhammer mythos (mythically speaking, there should be at least 5 types of Chaos dungeons or at least affiliation rules, 5 affiliations for Skaven, a "Necromancer"-themed Undead list and seperate Orc and Goblin lists). Even this doesn't cover the fact that 10 more BL's must be released for Lustria and the fact that there are many who would love to see the old Chaos Dwarfs (no longer being sold by GW) replaced with the Ogre Kingdoms.

I think there has to be a way around "creating" (create - verb - to avoid doing because we're too lazy) these tables. Perhaps only a little work could help?

Certainly no one has to agree with this, I'd just like to throw it out there. I propose that we create a D66 list for every race. For example, a D66 Goblin list with entries such as this:

11 - Higher BL
22 - Goblins
33 - Goblins
44 - Orcs
55 - Creep
66 - Higher BL

I'll explain "Creep" in a moment, though WC3 vets might have an idea of what I'm getting at. Next to the list, we have a few lists like this:

Battle Level 1
Goblins - D6 Goblins with Spears and D6 with Bows

Battle Level 5
Goblins - 2 sets of Specialist Goblins from the chart below and 1 Goblin Big Boss

 1 - XD6 Squig Hoppers
 4-5 - Something else
 6 - Something else

Battle Level 10
Goblins - 2 Goblin Warbosses, 2 Orc Leaders from the chart below, [more orc entries]

 Orc Leaders
 1-3 - Orc Big Boss
 4-6 - Black Orc Big Boss


"Creep" are the denizens of dungeons with no affiliation. Rogue Undead, Giant animals, Dragons and the like. They'd have their own chart and entries per BL, as they can be used in all dungeons.


Do you see where I'm going with this? There's only one D66 list for each race, which includes perhaps no more than 4 types of entries (Chaos might have Mortals, Daemons, Beasts and Creeps). Each Battle-level has a variable description for each entry, detailing what could possibly show up. If each race has one author who writes nothing more it wouldn't be that hard to write and in the end the process would be only one roll and a glance across the page longer than the current tables.

I know, this will probably never be suggested but I supposed I might as well submit it. Does it make sense? What do you think?
28/Jun/2005, 9:22 am Link to this post Send Email to Black Drazon   Send PM to Black Drazon
 
BassJam Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

Lord
Global user

Registered: 07-2003
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 538
Reply | Quote
Re: Race-Themed Dungeons?


For my own "Ultimate Warhammer" Campaign, I have a nasty, nasty idea. I will never finish, but you may at least consider this idea.

Step 1)Like a crazy person, I am slowly converting ALL WHFB creatures into WHQ (using additional stats like LD and Willpower from the WFRP info...)

1a)I am also updating existing WHQ Monsters. They will still appear on charts. For example, naked Goblins worth 20 Gold. However, Goblins might appear with Light armour (+2 Toughness) and be worth 40 Gold each, etc.

1b) Chaos Dwarves DO exist still - see the Storm of Chaos book for stats. The new models are crushing, but I want the funny hats as well emoticon

2)I am working out challenge ratings for each Monster in my Beastiary.

3)The eventual goal will be to EASILY create via copy/paste custom d66 tables for EACH adventure, depending on the Race of Monsters that inhabit the area, who the enemy is, etc.

4)I am thinking of scrapping the current way I give out adventures and have various NPC 'contacts' that people can meet. A Wizard's contact may be concerned with Skaven plots, while the Barbarian's may be more concerned with the doings of Beastmen in Norsca. It will be up to the players which quests they undertake.

5)I am planning a persistent map campaign, so that I can keep track of which race lives where. So, if an adventure is in a specific hex, that used to be Empire, but is now occupied by Dark Elves, then the d66 table will include Humans, Dark Elves, and whoever the target of the quest is.

---
"Mine is a high art. I wound with cruelty those who would harm me." - Archillicus
28/Jun/2005, 10:23 am Link to this post Send Email to BassJam   Send PM to BassJam
 
Black Drazon Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

Lord
Global user

Registered: 04-2005
Posts: 217
Reply | Quote
Re: Race-Themed Dungeons?


If you want a few already-converted races, I've already done Vampire Counts and Skaven. The biggest problem is that the warriors, tweaked to kill 3rd and 4th edition monsters, easily overpower the new 6th edition creatures. Try it. Your warriors will never, ever, ever lose, unless you do something stupid like me and convert war machines... Muhahahaha....

I'm not saying the CD's don't exist, I'm saying that two models, ever waiting to be sucked into the exhaust of their Hellcannon, do not a wide enough range of models make. :P

Do you have a system to create D66 tables? That's what this thread is about, if you have something it'd be great to see.
28/Jun/2005, 1:25 pm Link to this post Send Email to Black Drazon   Send PM to Black Drazon
 
BassJam Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

Lord
Global user

Registered: 07-2003
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 538
Reply | Quote
Re: Race-Themed Dungeons?


Actually, I find the 6th edition characters to be tougher, if you adapt the armour choices and special rules (I have all your Sylvanian stuff printed out, but haven't seen the Skaven ones...)

I DID originally want to have d66 tables for each race, but eventually I realized that it would be time-consuming (haha) to try to cover every eventuality in advance.

Now my idea is to set up a custom d66 encounter table for each combination of (Battle-level/Race/geographical area)...

The key to giving guidelines on how to set up a table like this is to have a Challenge Rating. Unfortunately, CRs are ALWAYS very subjective - and I don't think I'll be done with mine by the time you get 2nd edition off the ground...

The first thing I'm doing is comparing ratios, like 7-12 Giant Bats appear at BL 1 charts. Therefore, an individual Bat is 1/6 to 1/12 the strength of a standard 4-man adventuring party.

A single Minotaur, on the other hand, is a tough opponent at BL 1. It's challenge rating is 1, because it is an even match for an average party. When three Minos show up, that is a CR of 3, because that is a very tough encounter for a beginning group (as many have learned to their dismay!). Encounters that are that much over the dungeon level should be very rare, otherwise the party will exhaust their store of mana and one-use items and have to leave if they still live. On the other hand, those same 3 Minotaurs provide a mundane challenge for a BL 3 adventuring group.

If EVERY Monster has a Challenge Rating, then a GM/Monster Banker can easily whip up a chart or encounter deck to match the dungeon theme, designing easier ambush encounters as filler in the d66 while putting harrowing and deadly challenges in the 12,13, 54, and 55 slots.


---
"Mine is a high art. I wound with cruelty those who would harm me." - Archillicus
29/Jun/2005, 9:59 am Link to this post Send Email to BassJam   Send PM to BassJam
 
Black Drazon Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

Lord
Global user

Registered: 04-2005
Posts: 217
Reply | Quote
Re: Race-Themed Dungeons?


Well, good luck to you, then. Support for my idea isn't working, at least you've started, lol.

Hmm, where did I put those Skaven rules... Oh yes. Here:

[sign in to see URL]
30/Jun/2005, 7:00 am Link to this post Send Email to Black Drazon   Send PM to Black Drazon
 
BassJam Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

Lord
Global user

Registered: 07-2003
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 538
Reply | Quote
Re: Race-Themed Dungeons?


OT, but I like your HWRALFAD interpretation :bad: - though Skaven have low enough leadership that they will be subject to Break tests in my games as well...

---
"Mine is a high art. I wound with cruelty those who would harm me." - Archillicus
30/Jun/2005, 8:23 am Link to this post Send Email to BassJam   Send PM to BassJam
 
Black Drazon Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

Lord
Global user

Registered: 04-2005
Posts: 217
Reply | Quote
Re: Race-Themed Dungeons?


lol, HWFARALTFAD made for a very intersting play of the only Skaven dungeon I've ever done (mostly, the file was used for DCQ). That was a fun dungeon.
30/Jun/2005, 11:22 am Link to this post Send Email to Black Drazon   Send PM to Black Drazon
 
spikeinthepit Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

Lord
Global user

Registered: 01-2007
Location: Earth
Posts: 109
Reply | Quote
Re: Race-Themed Dungeons?


Hey there! just wondering if anyone ever got around to creating usable race themed battle-level tables? If anyones got some even incomplete ones i'd love to know.


---
http://spikeinthepit.my-php.net
19/Jan/2007, 10:50 am Link to this post Send Email to spikeinthepit   Send PM to spikeinthepit Yahoo
 


Add a reply





You are not logged in (login)