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Champion

Registered: 03-2017
Posts: 26
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Sting Spell and the Wand of Diabolum


I tried to search for a mention concerning this combo but Couldn't find anything, which is surprising.

Does this combo effectively neuter the impact of other warriors during combat? The Wizard using this combo appears to be able to wipe his board section, even if he has no power.

My question is, is there an official rule I am missing that means all spells cost at least one power to cast? Maybe something added by developers after the release?

Just a reminder for what I am talking about;

Sting

quote:

Pick any Monster on the same board section as the Wizard and roll 1D6.

On a score of 4, 5 or 6 the Monster takes 1 Wound, with no modifiers for
anything (Toughness, armour, Ignore Pain, etc.).

Target: Any Monster on the same board section as the Wizard
Duration Immediate



Wand of Diabolum

quote:

While using this wand all your Wizard's spells have their casting number
reduced by -1



This has never really come up for me, as when playing previously I never really acquired many "cost 1" spells, I used to think that they were fairly weak and a lot of them can only be used once per turn.

However, Sting does not have this rule. Further, it ignores modifiers and with the wand, it appears to cost nothing correct?

It means that besides ambushes, as soon as the Wizard can cast spells he can wipe everything on his board section! Other than "Large monsters" that cost more to target, but that means until you reach Battle level 7-8+ (where you start seeing more Large monsters) the party are just going to spending their time escorting the Wizard from room to room...

 

Last edited by Questicus, 1/Sep/2021, 8:17 pm
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Sith Kinks Profile
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Lord

Registered: 09-2013
Posts: 83
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Re: Sting Spell and the Wand of Diabolum


I can't find anything either. I've always assumed a minimum cost of 1, but it doesn't appear to be stated anywhere.

Wand of Diabolum is an incredibly powerful item, even just being able to cast healing hands for 1 power makes you close to invincible.

Maybe worth mentioning Sting is same board section only. Also fear, terror and petrify could foil your plans emoticon
1/Sep/2021, 9:25 pm Link to this post Send Email to Sith Kinks   Send PM to Sith Kinks Blog
 
Questicus Profile
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Champion

Registered: 03-2017
Posts: 26
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Re: Sting Spell and the Wand of Diabolum


Yes I forgot about psychology. Even so though, its pretty powerful right off the bat. Looking through the dungeon list, you don't even see "large monsters" until BL 7.

That means the Wizard aside from psychology rolls should be able to wipe his board section (and possibly move onto another board section to the do the same) all the way until near the end of the dungeon.

With those two in combo, Sting is easy to get as it only costs one, you can have it by BL 2 at the very least. That leaves a lucky roll for the wand, although somehow, every time I have played, the Wizard has got it quite early (playing on Vanilla loot table the first few times, and a custom one since then.)

You would have thought the designers would have made it only once per turn like other level 1 spells.

And yes, your right about healing hands. We have made a lot of use it in our current run, the warriors are pretty much immortal so as long as they protect the wizard.

Last edited by Questicus, 1/Sep/2021, 9:57 pm
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Littlemonk Profile
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Administrator

Registered: 07-2008
Posts: 438
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Re: Sting Spell and the Wand of Diabolum


quote:

Questicus wrote:

I tried to search for a mention concerning this combo but Couldn't find anything, which is surprising.

Does this combo effectively neuter the impact of other warriors during combat? The Wizard using this combo appears to be able to wipe his board section, even if he has no power.

My question is, is there an official rule I am missing that means all spells cost at least one power to cast? Maybe something added by developers after the release?

Just a reminder for what I am talking about;

Sting

quote:

Pick any Monster on the same board section as the Wizard and roll 1D6.

On a score of 4, 5 or 6 the Monster takes 1 Wound, with no modifiers for
anything (Toughness, armour, Ignore Pain, etc.).

Target: Any Monster on the same board section as the Wizard
Duration Immediate



Wand of Diabolum

quote:

While using this wand all your Wizard's spells have their casting number
reduced by -1



This has never really come up for me, as when playing previously I never really acquired many "cost 1" spells, I used to think that they were fairly weak and a lot of them can only be used once per turn.

However, Sting does not have this rule. Further, it ignores modifiers and with the wand, it appears to cost nothing correct?

It means that besides ambushes, as soon as the Wizard can cast spells he can wipe everything on his board section! Other than "Large monsters" that cost more to target, but that means until you reach Battle level 7-8+ (where you start seeing more Large monsters) the party are just going to spending their time escorting the Wizard from room to room...

 



Let common sense prevail. Having a Casting Number 0 would be severely broken, as you've obviously stated.

---
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Warhammer Quest Customized

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Questicus Profile
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Champion

Registered: 03-2017
Posts: 26
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Re: Sting Spell and the Wand of Diabolum


Oh aye, thankfully I am playing the Wizard and so I can at least choose how I approach this.

Personally I will probably just hold it in my back pocket for when I just want to clear the room of chaff (We're BL 3/4 so sometimes we get spiders, rats and snotling's and they rarely do anything but slow the game down.) or maybe role-play the Wizard as selfish, only killing things when they are a severe threat to him.

As Sith Kinks pointed out, as powerful as it is, it does have some hard counters (large monsters, petrify etc) and near the end of the dungeon tables (BL 7-10) I suspect it will become completely useless.

I actually have -2 to power costs on my Wizard, one is the wand, another is a Skull staff. So I can cast Healing hands for free as well...

I will just have to carefully manage how I use these powers. With great power, comes great responsibility. 😉

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Lord

Registered: 09-2013
Posts: 83
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Re: Sting Spell and the Wand of Diabolum


quote:

Questicus wrote:
Oh aye, thankfully I am playing the Wizard and so I can at least choose how I approach this..... only killing things when they are a severe threat to him.


Bearing in mind the head topic "RIGHT and WRONG way to play", if that works for you, great.

Personally, having the ability to choose whether to auto-kill any threat, without much restriction would devalue the game for me. I would suggest introducing a house rule that you feel is fair. I think players should try to be as powerful as possible and the rules should keep them in check.

I few suggestions:

- Minimum power 1.
- Only cast 1 spell per turn at power 0.
- Only use the wand once per spell per turn.

Needless to say, casting healing hands for free must surely make the game a little less interesting?
6/Sep/2021, 6:41 am Link to this post Send Email to Sith Kinks   Send PM to Sith Kinks Blog
 
Questicus Profile
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Champion

Registered: 03-2017
Posts: 26
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Re: Sting Spell and the Wand of Diabolum


Yes, a large part of the fun is the impending doom. However the Wizard is one of those characters in the vanilla game that has many routes to becoming overpowered.

I remember our last BL 10 game (Wizard had Chalice of Sorcery, multiple rods, broaches of power, etc) the Wizard was using Vortex to clear out most rooms easily enough.

But it always felt like it was almost necessary to keep up with Greater demons, dragons etc, so my fellow players were almost begging for the Vortex every time we got a full room of horror just as much as they sighed every time the Wizard basically won a dungeon by himself.

It seems a balancing act playing the Wizard.

Tomorrow will be the first full session where we will try this whole system out, as the Wizard only leveled up at the end of the last session. If we get bored wiping rooms and fully healing every other action then I think your ideas should work.

Maybe only one 0 power spell per BL, to still maintain that value. Indeed, even 1 cost Healing Hands is pretty powerful though.
6/Sep/2021, 7:19 am Link to this post Send Email to Questicus   Send PM to Questicus Blog
 
Sith Kinks Profile
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Lord

Registered: 09-2013
Posts: 83
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Re: Sting Spell and the Wand of Diabolum


Yeh, I don't think there was much playtesting for BL 10 wizards.

We have limits on how many broaches you can wear, 'equipping' rods / staffs / wands and also a slightly less powerful version of Vortex emoticon

I guess even an all powerful Wizard can fall if he rolls a 1 for his Greater Daemon roll or is frozen by a white dragon.

quote:

Questicus wrote:

Maybe only one 0 power spell per BL, to still maintain that value.

That would work.
6/Sep/2021, 8:34 am Link to this post Send Email to Sith Kinks   Send PM to Sith Kinks Blog
 
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Champion

Registered: 03-2017
Posts: 26
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Re: Sting Spell and the Wand of Diabolum


So we trialed this combo in our session today, I spent most of our game sort of holding onto it, not wanting to use something that was clearly broken (I use Freeze and Windblast as my go to spells).

However at some point we were accosted by a bunch of Dragon ogres and Mummies and were in a little bother. Thankfully, the Barbarian is fairly powerful, with about 10 Toughness and wielding a +2D6 sword (Battle level 4) so we were not sure to die but then the three stone trolls came.

In response I cast my "infinite" hornet swarm using Sting and wiped them off the board almost instantly.

Needless to say, and as expected it wasn't fun and just felt cheaty, as did casting free healing hands.

In the end, instead of awkwardly trying to fix it, we agreed I should just re-roll my BL 4 (4D6) spell purchases again from leveling up and choose new spells.

Karma struck because I rolled a bunch of 2's and a 5, thankfully, I had just enough to grab "Carnival of Death" which I think is more fun.

Now I have ->

Invulnerability
Freeze
Healing hands.
Windblast.
Lightning bolt. (Starting spell)
Carnival of death.
Iron skin. (Starting spell)
Resurrection. (Starting spell)

Which feels much more fun to use.

Last edited by Questicus, 7/Sep/2021, 3:58 am
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